Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections Page 64
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JSRoman @ 6th Aug 04:27PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Wouldn't you have to be a Comcast customer 1st? How is that working out for you?
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TheSaint @ 6th Aug 05:59PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Comcast seems to be cutting off bit torrent traffic on private trackers, or at least in this area. I've just signed up for Comcast HSI. Speedtest.net and the like all come out with decent speeds, but whenever I use a private tracker the connections keep on resetting. Public trackers seem to work just fine with upload and download. What is worse than just the private trackers not working, I've noticed that when utorrent is running webpages also take MUCH, MUCH, longer to resolve. As a new Comcast customer, I am NOT impressed. No hard feelings to the techs here on DSLR that are trying to help out, but this is not even what I would consider Internet Lite. Will complaining to the local Comcast office make any difference? Will they even consider allowing more traffic in on a specific account? Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide!
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EG @ 6th Aug 07:37PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by italiansmoke :
Hmmm... okay.
Way agree with Norman on this !
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anon @ 6th Aug 08:59PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Yeah, using that logic, employers should delay paychecks if employees are late with their reports or projects or slow with customer service. Brilliant logic once again. :uhh:
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sturmvogel @ 7th Aug 12:01AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
I am. I still have their cable TV service, with some outages, not that bad. Overpriced and they keep whisking away channels to the digital tier, which I also have, but annoying for my TV in the kitchen.
Next question ?
--
Treason is a matter of dates
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sturmvogel @ 7th Aug 12:02AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by goody two :
Yeah, using that logic, employers should delay paychecks if employees are late with their reports or projects or slow with customer service. Brilliant logic once again. :uhh:
And they do, it is called performance evaluation and corresponding compensation.
--
Treason is a matter of dates
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sturmvogel @ 7th Aug 12:45AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by funchords :said by sturmvogel :
We should "delay" paying Comcast for 3 months. After all, it is to better load balance the finances so that all of our creditors will have a better overall "experience".
We are not blocking payment, just delaying, so it must be right. Right ?
Priceless! -- Simply Priceless! :)
Yeah, they get quite upset when applying their logic to them as I see the "volunteer" supporters coming out. I am not doing so well financialy and I feel CC is "abusing" my finances with their high prices and continuous rate hikes. They "must drastically alter" their billing practices. How much is acceptable, I do not know and could not tell them if I knew, because they would just bill under that limit that I already deem acceptable and that would be bad, because everybody would do it. I will look around each month how much the electric and water companies charge and I will decide if CC is in the 0.1% top billers in my household. If yes, it is a resource hog and is depriving other services of using my money.
--
Treason is a matter of dates
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funchords @ 7th Aug 03:23AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Hi TheSaint,
Comcast seems to be cutting off bit torrent traffic on private trackers, or at least in this area.
Sorry, I can't figure out why that would be. The bits on the wire aren't any different.
I've noticed that when utorrent is running webpages also take MUCH, MUCH, longer to resolve.
That's a sign that you have your uTorrent upload speed limit set incorrectly. If you're on a 6/1 Mbps cable connection, I would set your upload speed limit to somewhere around 16 KB/s to 24 KB/s.
Don't be fooled with the 1 Mbps upload size that you think you have -- it's probably shared beyond all reasonableness. So that you don't interfere with your own and your neighbor's use of the net, I would treat it as about a third of that.
If you're going to be a heavy user of P2P, I would recommend DSL. Even though the peak speeds are slower, the prices are cheaper the amount of bandwidth that they can carry without interfering with the neighborhood is a lot higher.
Cable Internet has its strengths, P2P file-sharing is not one of them.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
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anon @ 7th Aug 10:22AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by sturmvogel :said by goody two :
Yeah, using that logic, employers should delay paychecks if employees are late with their reports or projects or slow with customer service. Brilliant logic once again. :uhh:
And they do, it is called performance evaluation and corresponding compensation.
Let's keep our on the ball here. We were talking about delaying, not adjusting, payments. Performance evaluation/corresponding compensation do not result in delaying pay checks.
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sturmvogel @ 7th Aug 11:51AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by goody two :said by sturmvogel :said by goody two :
Yeah, using that logic, employers should delay paychecks if employees are late with their reports or projects or slow with customer service. Brilliant logic once again. :uhh:
And they do, it is called performance evaluation and corresponding compensation.
Let's keep our on the ball here. We were talking about delaying, not adjusting, payments. Performance evaluation/corresponding compensation do not result in delaying pay checks.
If performance is not satisfactory, an employee could be put on a developmental plan with or without a temporary pay cut until the performance improves. When the performance improves, the full pay rate is applied.
I guess it is a delay oy payments.
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Treason is a matter of dates
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NormanS @ 7th Aug 01:11PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by TheSaint :
Comcast seems to be cutting off bit torrent traffic on private trackers, or at least in this area. I've just signed up for Comcast HSI. Speedtest.net and the like all come out with decent speeds, but whenever I use a private tracker the connections keep on resetting.
Not having used private trackers on a Comcast connection, I can't directly address that. But, in order to distinguish between public and private trackers, Comcast would have to take the time to build up a database of which trackers are public, and which are private. A rather costly, and, thus, unlikely activity on the part of Comcast. Without that knowledge, how would the Sandvine appliance distinguish between the two?
Public trackers seem to work just fine with upload and download. What is worse than just the private trackers not working, I've noticed that when utorrent is running webpages also take MUCH, MUCH, longer to resolve.
Having used my sister's Comcast connection to download fansubbed anime, I can assure you that my usage never adversely affected my sister, or her family. The thing is, I was always "upload impaired" with uTorrent while working her connection. I never pestered my brother-in-law about poking holes through his NAT appliance. I just downloaded until complete, but kept the tracker until I could return to my DSL connection and seed until reaching 1.050 (which is where I have set uTorrent to automatically stop uploading).
BTW, on my DSL connection, I used to throttle upload way back (maybe half, or so), when I had a standard, bridged DSL modem. I have since replaced that with a SpeedStream 4100 DSL modem, which, reportedly, performs outbound ACK packet prioritization. And added a D-Link DIR-655, with the default QoS setting. Although my connection theoretically can sustain 39kB/s upload, I still throttle it back. I have uTorrent set for 29kB/s upload.
I would strongly advise you to consider the advice of funchords. He knows way more about how this stuff works than I do, and way more about how cable (in general) and Comcast (in particular) work.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum
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anon @ 7th Aug 01:23PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Pay cuts are just that, not delays, as employees won't get back the reduced amount.
The reality is that in general poorly performing employees get warnings and eventually get fired if improvements are not made.
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italiansmoke @ 7th Aug 01:55PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
I have my torrent upload speed set at 15kb/s.
I thought upload was the speed you alloted to seeding. Is there any other benefit to using a higher upload speed? Does it improve your download speed?
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sturmvogel @ 7th Aug 01:56PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by goody two :
Pay cuts are just that, not delays, as employees won't get back the reduced amount.
The reality is that in general poorly performing employees get warnings and eventually get fired if improvements are not made.
Your two paragraphs contradict each other.
--
Treason is a matter of dates
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anon @ 7th Aug 02:21PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
There's no contradiction at all between the two paragraphs, and I've been in management position in commercial lending for 20 years where I've dealt with plenty of different commercial clients. I've worked at banks and finance companies and have have to give warnings to employees who have had poor performance and let go the ones who didn't. Pay cuts were not given, since employees should be given an opportunity to improve. If they can't improve, pay cuts won't cover the deficiencies; instead, you hire other people who can perform to replace the ones who aren't.
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italiansmoke @ 7th Aug 02:25PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
reply to NormanS:
I have my torrent upload speed set at 15kb/s.
I thought upload was the speed you alloted to seeding. Is there any other benefit to using a higher upload speed? Does it improve your download speed?
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NormanS @ 7th Aug 02:54PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by italiansmoke :
I have my torrent upload speed set at 15kb/s.
That should work for alleviating surfing issues.
I thought upload was the speed you alloted to seeding. Is there any other benefit to using a higher upload speed? Does it improve your download speed?
I have never noticed any improvement in download speed with higher upload; but I have only used public trackers, and I suspect that any benefit would only apply to private trackers.
My nominal DSL upload is 512kbps, but there is a 15% overhead, so actual speed is closer to 425kbps. AT&T does not "overprovision", as some other ISPs do. Because of my nominal UL, uTorrent pegs my max upload at 43kB/s. By rough calculation, I estimate that it is closer to 39kB/s. Because saturating the upload bandwidth has an adverse affect on other Internet activity, it is usually advisable to throttle upload instead of running at the maximum. However, most of the adverse effects are due to packet contention. Delaying outbound ACK packets, which happens on a saturated upload, slows web surfing, and the like.
My modem, as I have stated, reportedly prioritizes outbound ACK packets, over other outbound packets, which would also alleviate the effects of upload congestion. And, in addition, my D-Link DIR-655 has some kind of QoS algorithm. The result is that I don't suffer the ill effects of upload saturation as severely as would be the case with no QoS of any kind.
Other than completing the unity ratio expected of BT P2P faster, I can't think of any reason for faster upload. I think funchords has suggested that, even for DSL connections, which are better able to handle P2P bandwidth demand, that throttling back is "kinder" to the network. While the 29kB/s that I am using is probably a killer on a cable plant, it doesn't seem so hard on DSL. However, if funchords were to suggest that I should cut back to 66% (26kB/s), instead of my current 75% (29kB/s), I'd do it. As a member of a larger community, I should minimize any adverse impact my activity would have on other members of the community.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum
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Pizz @ 7th Aug 03:04PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
I would just personally switch over to DSL if you plan on doing alot of P2P or Torrent traffic. It's been made perfectly clear by MSOs - that no way in hell we're going to accommodate those type of users on it's network.
Maybe when docsis 3.0 hits - but currently, dont use P2P and Torrent sites so much.
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funchords @ 7th Aug 04:59PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by italiansmoke :
I have my torrent upload speed set at 15kb/s.
I thought upload was the speed you alloted to seeding. Is there any other benefit to using a higher upload speed? Does it improve your download speed?
Yes. The BitTorrent is a tit-for-tat protocol that links the best sharers (uploaders) together for the fastest transfers. If you're only running 1 torrent at a time, 15 KB/s is plenty. I wouldn't run more than 2 torrents at a time on a Comcast connection, and with 2 torrents you'd want to set your upload limit to around 30 KB/s (explanation: it works out to 3 slots per upload, 5 KB/s per slot). During prime-time, I would (and did) run only 1 torrent at 15 KB/s.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
More fun, more features, Join BroadbandReports.com, it's free...
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funchords @ 7th Aug 05:12PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Good grief! Are there cross-linked topics somewhere or has this "delay the payments" joke actually spun this far off-topic?
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anon @ 7th Aug 05:21PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Psst. I was being just as humorous as Sturm was. But enough has been said.
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ajax25 @ 15th Aug 10:30AM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by ajax25 :
As of last night 9 downloaders at 90.7%. Nothing moving.
I was able to connect to one of the seeders after
stopping and restarting the torrent. Only 16K of
data got through, but I was able to confirm that that
seeder was on comcast.
This baby is still hanging at around 95%. Still two
seeders, one I know is comcast.
There is also a second torrent hung in the upper 90%
range, have not been able to see the seeder for that one.
If the seeder does connect they get kicked very fast.
I'm in NJ if that makes any difference.
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abcstore @ 9th Sep 05:20PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by NormanS :said by italiansmoke :
I have my torrent upload speed set at 15kb/s.
That should work for alleviating surfing issues.
Having upload set to 28_k_bit on a 8/2Mbit pipe kills the whole thing almost completely. No ping, no DNS, no surfing.
ABC
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funchords @ 9th Sep 05:30PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by abcstore :
Having upload set to 28_k_bit on a 8/2Mbit pipe kills the whole thing almost completely. No ping, no DNS, no surfing.
Are you working through a router? If so, try disabling DHT in your P2P client and close it. Reset your router (power off and on), wait for a few moments, then restart your bittorrent client.
If that helps, your router cannot handle the high number of connections that DHT creates. Turning DHT off shouldn't affect you badly, as DHT's main purpose is to function as a backup tracker.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
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NormanS @ 9th Sep 05:35PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by abcstore :
Having upload set to 28_k_bit on a 8/2Mbit pipe kills the whole thing almost completely. No ping, no DNS, no surfing.
I've only got 3/0.5 Mb/s, but letting the upload run at 39 kB/s (yes, that's Bytes!) does not hurt DNS, or surfing. Ping only suffers slightly. The worst effect is on streaming video (gets very choppy).
It helps that the router (D-Link DIR-655) does QoS, and the DSL modem (SpeedStream 4100) performs ACK packet prioritization.
P.S. I normally run the upload throttled back to 29 kB/s.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum
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abcstore @ 10th Sep 12:39PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
My router is a FreeBSD handling multiple T1s and MPLS lines. 6/2Mbit cable line is a tiny fraction of what's going on.
At times you can seed and browse but 99% of the time seeding kills everything (through cable).
ABC
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This signature is NOT for sale!
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funchords @ 10th Sep 12:49PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
Do your packets go through Warrenton? (can you check via traceroute?)
If so, it is very, very important that you report this to Comcast tech support and let them know that you are in their Network Management test market. Please let me know.
See »www.comcast.net/terms/network/ for (sketchy) details.
Test market or no, your results are pretty surprising. So is it any amount of seeding that kills everything? Can you turn it down to 5 KB/s (40 kbps) or 1 KB/s (8 kbps) and still be prevented?
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Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
More features, more fun, Join BroadbandReports.com, it's free...
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abcstore @ 10th Sep 02:17PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
said by funchords :Do your packets go through Warrenton? (can you check via traceroute?)
If so, it is very, very important that you report this to Comcast tech support and let them know that you are in their Network Management test market. Please let me know.
See »
www.comcast.net/terms/network/ for (sketchy) details.
Test market or no, your results are pretty surprising. So is it any amount of seeding that kills everything? Can you turn it down to 5 KB/s (40 kbps) or 1 KB/s (8 kbps) and still be prevented?
3 6 ms 6 ms 6 ms ge-3-1-ur01.chesterfield.va.richmond.comcast.net [68.86.17 4.185]
4 4 ms 6 ms 6 ms te-1-2-ar01.chesterfield.va.richmond.comcast.net [68.86.17 2.70]
5 13 ms 12 ms 13 ms te-4-3-cr01.charlotte.nc.cbone.comcast.net [68.86.72.133]
6 19 ms 15 ms 17 ms te-1-1-cr01.richmond.va.cbone.comcast.net [68.86.68.110]
7 15 ms 17 ms 16 ms te-1-1-cr01.mclean.va.cbone.comcast.net [68.86.68.114]
8 18 ms 20 ms 20 ms te-4-2-ar01.newcastle.de.bo.comcast.net [68.86.72.162]
9 21 ms 23 ms 21 ms te-1-1-ar02.ndceast.pa.bo.comcast.net [68.86.228.102]
10 22 ms 21 ms 20 ms te-4-1-ur02.ndceast.pa.bo.comcast.net [68.86.134.49]
11 21 ms 21 ms 21 ms 68.87.98.12
12 20 ms 21 ms 19 ms 68.87.60.144
Seeding at 5Kb/s I can't even reply to this thread... Neither could I open the link you provided.
ABC
P.S. Boy, am I glad FIOS finally got to my house! 15Mbit and no throttling
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This signature is NOT for sale!
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funchords @ 10th Sep 03:17PM:
Re: Comcast is using Sandvine to manage P2P Connections
You are about 100 miles from Warrenton ... hmmm, no explanation.
I'm wondering if something in the FreeBSD setup might be squelching you -- maybe a MPLS rule or a NAT table limitation working against you? Can you plug directly into the cable modem and test?
What Comcast is doing in most areas (the non-trial areas) should have no effect on DNS or web surfing. It would kill seeding, however, by throwing TCP RST packets at your connections.
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