My Ordeal with Bell Page 2

My Ordeal with Bell Page 2
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Oinktastic @ 6th Nov 11:30AM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by TSI Mike :

Just a note, guys. We talked this morning and Bell's confirmed an issue in the Hurontario/Erin Mills area with slow speeds and packet loss during the evenings affecting a number of customers. It's been given a tentative date of 11/22 for the fix, as they're waiting on the equipment they need to come in to do the repair.

There you have it. The TSI difference :)

TSI: Yea, there's a problem and here's the date we reckon it will be fixed.

Bhell: What? Your service isn't working? Your modem is bad, your wiring is bad, we don't support our own equipment and we believe you're an idiot. Have a good day :)
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anon @ 6th Nov 01:23PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Oinktastic :

There you have it. The TSI difference :)

TSI: Yea, there's a problem and here's the date we reckon it will be fixed.

Bhell: What? Your service isn't working? Your modem is bad, your wiring is bad, we don't support our own equipment and we believe you're an idiot. Have a good day :)

Again I must be blind or something. What is the TSI difference? I am seeking this. Feel free to honestly tell me.

After 2 months, 8-tickets for one person, and 1 month and uncountable tickets for another person, today it's announced there is a problem and that's the TSI difference?

w00t! Sign me up. Sorry to pee in your cheerios, but I don't see the difference Oinktastic.

Is this any different than Bell? TSI basically brought this customer for a ride for 2 months, as did Bell bring their own customers for a ride for two months in all likelihood (this problem is also seen in the Bell forum).

So what differentiated TSI from Bell here? What made them different? The only thing said, after a couple of months, was that there is a problem confirmed by Bell and a tentative resolution date by Bell.

So you are saying what Bell told them after two months is the TSI difference! :hmm: (that does sum it up btw)

Sorry, I don't see the quality and difference that makes TSI different than any other Bell-Wholesale internet supplier who are dependent on Bell and give people months of service and support runarounds as was the case here.

Does this person get a refund of any type since it is a confirmed problem and it has been two months of nothing?

What is the difference? Bell would have credited this person for a confirmed material disruption in service after 2 months. Will TSI?

I'll wait to see the equal before I see the difference.
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satchmo @ 6th Nov 12:32PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

Here is an image I took of the install.

As you can see, I have the main line running into the POTS splitter. The phone line can easily be disconnected to rule out any discrepancies. The problem is still occurring at the exact same time.

The alleged voltage short diagnosed by the Bell tek was on the Bell side outside somewhere along the street, and was corrected.

I also did receive the same information that TSI Mike provided, perhaps we spoke on the phone today.

It is good to hear there is a possible solution to this on-going problem. It just sucks that after a full month of not being able to use my connection, I now have to wait another month to have it fixed, possibly longer.

I still find it strange that my next door neighbor and others in the neighborhood who are on Bell, that are probably connected to the same line as Teksavvy users are not exhibiting ANY problems. Coincidence? Now they're waiting for a flux capacitor to arrive and repair the 1.21 gigawatts frequency damaged lines? C'mon.
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anon @ 6th Nov 01:23PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by satchmo :

The phone line can easily be disconnected to rule out any discrepancies.

Looks good. You might want to clean up the twisted wire coming out of the low pass filter though.
If you don't mind me asking what did is cost for this to be done?

Now they're waiting for a flux capacitor to arrive and repair the 1.21 gigawatts frequency damaged lines? C'mon.

:D
I like how Bell leaves everyone in the dark until these problems manifest.
Makes you wonder the other people that may be having problems right now and have no idea.
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AkFubar @ 6th Nov 02:15PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by xbell :

I like how Bell leaves everyone in the dark until these problems manifest.
Makes you wonder the other people that may be having problems right now and have no idea.

That's why customers are leaving Bhell in droves. People don't put up with that kind of crappy treatment anymore. The thing is since Bhell isn't changing their own attitude one can only presume they are too stupid to realize it. Guess they will eventually go down with it. :D
--
"No matter where you go, there you are." - Buckaroo Banzai
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MaynardKrebs @ 6th Nov 06:30PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

Which year?
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Arbalister @ 6th Nov 07:20PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Dashock :

And before this have not had an issue for almost a year and half teksavvy guys are awesome but their reliance on bell techs just frackin sucks.

Unfortunately we (indie ISPs) can't touch the lines, don't have acccess to the Bell boxes, remotes, CO's etc. We'd *love* to be able to use our own techs.

When I put in Bell tickets for my customers I tell them all the same thing. "This will probably take at least 2 visits by a Bell tech - the first one for him to tell you it's your modem (or something inside) and the next for him to actually test something."

I've even gotten into the habit of sending a loaner modem out to them to try, first, so we can put that right into the ticket.
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Arbalister @ 6th Nov 07:33PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Blind to QA :

The difference is that TSI posts, publicly, that they have been informed by the wire maintence people...Bell...That there is a definate, diagnosed, proven problem affecting all customers in a given area.

Bell, on the other hand, still, to this day, will tell you "It's your modem" even though they've informed a wholesaler that its' a line issue, known and scheduled for repair. In fact, the likely only reason they informed their wholesaler is that htey were bullied into it, on behalf of the TSI customers in that area that they've been working to get corrected. Given their own mind, Bell would have said "it's your modem" and left.

Is this any different than Bell? TSI basically brought this customer for a ride for 2 months, as did Bell bring their own customers for a ride for two months in all likelihood (this problem is also seen in the Bell forum).

Untrue. Teksavvy did everything in their power to correct the issue, including conferencing the customer, a TSI manager, and a Bell service manager. TSI can't be held responsible for the time it took when Bell won't play fair and say, "Yes, we know there is a problem, we're scheduled to fix it ..."

I'm quite sure that if Bell would notify their wholesalers about network problems - as TSI does, I get a note every single time they expect a network problem, regardless of whether it might affect my customers - TSI could have informed the guys in this thread that were affected, and said "scheduled for a fix on 11/22. I'm quite sure that just knowing that they're *not* going crazy, and that the fix was coming, would have satisfied them.

What is the difference? Bell would have credited this person for a confirmed material disruption in service after 2 months. Will TSI?

I call BS on that. There's no way Bell would credit you for hte problem - they won't even admit it to you. And now that they *have* admitted it, they should be issuing a refund to TSI for their affected customers - all of them. Want to bet it doesn't happen? And if it did, I'm quite sure TSI would credit the customer.
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dslrocker3 @ 6th Nov 07:41PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Arbalister :

"This will probably take at least 2 visits by a Bell tech - the first one for him to tell you it's your modem (or something inside) and the next for him to actually test something."

I believe the first technician is only there to pretend to examine the issue. I think that they purposely show up to brush off TSI's customer. Once I had a Bell technician show up to diagnose a DSL issue but he forgot to bring any DSL test equipment so you he could at least properly pretend to do work on the line.

Here's a common order of things:
1. tech visit scheduled but never shows up, profile slowed down
2. technician visits, agrees with that the problem is with the outside line, will tell you anything - some things might be true, some things might be made up. examples: bridge tap, voltage cross, or just that distance is the issue. Technician will tell you "cabling department" will be dispatch but it rarely ever happens. despite what the on site technician tells you, your ticket will be closed and you will be told that you have a defective modem.
3.you call to open another ticket and bell plays more profile games and then closes the ticket.
4. another ticket gets opened and Bell sends another technician. this time, the technician might actually do something including trying different pairs or installing a new drop wire. You will get told that you will be installed on a RDSLAM when one is avaialble which should solve your problems.
5. after 6 months of hoping to get transfered to a remote dslam, bell will finally agree to do it. once they do dispatch a tech to perform the transfer to a remote, you will get a phone call from the tech and he will know nothing about the request and the ticket will once again just say "slow speed". If you are lucky, you will actually get the rdslam transfer after arguing.
Did I miss anything with the Bell standard procedure?
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anon @ 6th Nov 08:56PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Arbalister :

I call BS on that. There's no way Bell would credit you for hte problem - they won't even admit it to you. And now that they *have* admitted it, they should be issuing a refund to TSI for their affected customers - all of them. Want to bet it doesn't happen? And if it did, I'm quite sure TSI would credit the customer.

Arbalister,

Good reply. Appreciate it. +1 to you.

However, I have been compensated by Bell when we complained on a material defect, just an FYI (Not many people complain properly and to the proper people maybe? Best guess).

Why shouldn't Bell-wholesalers do the same when it's a material defect? They can submit credits to be applied. Rocky even stated this a few times over the years. they are apparently stuck till Bell accepts it (the credit), then they can give it to the customer.

This would be a CRTC issue I believe.

Why isn't this being done? Especially in a material defect case affecting their customers. Even Bell has a material defect clause. TSI doesn't, and people still pay for a month of internet in advance that they can't use (ie gamers etc).

Has TSI submitted a credit in order to at least give this guy back some money with this material defect in service?

"The difference is that TSI posts, publicly, that they have been informed by the wire maintence people...Bell...That there is a definate, diagnosed, proven problem affecting all customers in a given area."

This I agree with. Openness, to an extent, is their strong point that is not seen with Bell. Does this differentiate them from Bell? Yes. From others Bell-wholesalers? relative to some maybe-yes, relative to some no.

TSI could do more. Bottom line for me.
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Arbalister @ 7th Nov 12:37AM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by dslrocker3 :

I believe the first technician is only there to pretend to examine the issue. I think that they purposely show up to brush off TSI's customer. Once I had a Bell technician show up to diagnose a DSL issue but he forgot to bring any DSL test equipment so you he could at least properly pretend to do work on the line.

Here's a common order of things:
1. tech visit scheduled but never shows up, profile slowed down
2. technician visits, agrees with that the problem is with the outside line, will tell you anything - some things might be true, some things might be made up. examples: bridge tap, voltage cross, or just that distance is the issue. Technician will tell you "cabling department" will be dispatch but it rarely ever happens. despite what the on site technician tells you, you ticket will be closed and you will be told that you have a defective modem.
3.you call to open another ticket and bell plays more profile games and then closes the ticket.
4. another ticket gets opened and Bell sends another technician. this time, the technician might actually do something including trying different pairs or installing a new drop wire. You will get told that you will be installed on a RDSLAM when one is avaialble which should solve your problems.
5. after 6 months of hoping to get transfered to a remote dslam, bell will finally agree to do it. once you they do dispatch a tech to perform the transfer to a remote, you will get a phone call from the tech and he will know nothing about the request and the ticket will once again just say "slow speed". If you are lucky, you will actually get the rdslam transfer after arguing.
Did I miss anything with the Bell standard procedure?

You forgot one.

Technician shows up, tells you that the problem is inside wiring, but they can't fix it because you're not a Bell customer...if you were on Bell DSL the problem would never even manifest. Offers you "Employee Special" coupon for Bell internet...you just need to quote his employee number in the space provided.

Yes, really - I've had several customers complain about this, a few even brought me the documentation. That was a complaint to the Competition Bureau...
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anon @ 7th Nov 10:31AM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Arbalister :

Technician shows up, tells you that the problem is inside wiring, but they can't fix it because you're not a Bell customer...if you were on Bell DSL the problem would never even manifest. Offers you "Employee Special" coupon for Bell internet...you just need to quote his employee number in the space provided.

Yes, really - I've had several customers complain about this, a few even brought me the documentation. That was a complaint to the Competition Bureau...

Yes the union employee's are now getting a kick-back (commission) for each customer they bring back to bell. This was on their union website.

So if your run an indie ISP (or similar) and get a tech out to your customer, they walk in their home selling Bell and telling them this would never happen with Bell.
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anon @ 7th Nov 11:18AM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by indeedy :

Yes the union employee's are now getting a kick-back (commission) for each customer they bring back to bell. This was on their union website.

I get the call from these people to fix their inside wiring issue. I show up and guess what? No problems.

As to the bonus (rewards program) it is quite lucrative.
I have heard of guys getting hundreds and even into the thousands when the bonus is paid out (last month).
Apparently Bell has agreed to pay the tax on it so extra is added to compensate for that.

What's that saying, "follow the money".
It seems the sales program set up by call center managers has been so successful that BTS is in on the action now.

Expect more of this executive corporate kleptoparasitism from Bell in all their divisions that are customer facing.
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Doctorphate @ 7th Nov 11:38AM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

And how much do you get paid xbell?

All your posts are bell slanted from what I've seen.

I'm in agreement however that the people in the call centers don't deserve to be shot because their hands are tied by bell. I talked to one and at the end of the conversation I gave her the teksavvy website and told her to apply to work for them because it would be alot more enjoyable for her... I heard her writing it down on paper. :)

Not all bell employees are bad, but bell techs are like most car salesmen. they use the hard sell technique which means they SELL to you... In my business we use the customer focused approach which makes the customer Buy from me. Being sold something and buying something are huge differences.
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anon @ 7th Nov 12:32PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

said by Doctorphate :

And how much do you get paid xbell? All your posts are bell slanted from what I've seen.

From Bell nothing. Yes the posts are Bell slanted. As in critical. Do a search.
Or better yet look up to my last post an re-read it. Have you had your morning coffee yet I don't think you are awake?
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fourboxers @ 7th Nov 12:16PM:
(topic move) My Ordeal with Bell

Moderator Action
The post that was here (and all 3 followups to it), has been moved to a new topic .. »OT
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Dashock @ 7th Nov 03:53PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

Well to be honest i've always had Teksavvy always inform me of a possible problem thru email and ive always appreciated that. But this time they dropped the ball now i understand its not fully their fault but it took a couple of calls and a couple of weeks for them to actually tell me theres a problem.

But the funny thing is when one person admits the problem the next day the other person doesnt know theres a problem. All i know is the next time i call and they ask me to re test my side for the problem i wont be happy. Teksavvy said they fixed their side from the recent large amount of customers jumping ship.

Now were waiting on Bell how long have they known aboot this problem and it takes them close to 3 weeks to fix the problem ??? Something does not seem right i wanted to tape the conversation infact i think im gonna call in today and ask teksavvy to put me thru bell managers as to why without speaking to me a 2nd tech wrote everythings fine and i accepted the speed.
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Dashock @ 7th Nov 03:58PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

CRTC needs to read this giving bell more money they should feel ashamed of themsleves. Can we not disband the CRTC or fire them or do something they obviously are not working for our best intererst.
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anon @ 8th Nov 11:52AM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

What is the area covered for the Hurontario/Erin Mills area since they don't intersect?
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Dashock @ 17th Nov 12:02PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

Now as of the past 3 days i keep getting disconnected it was once every hour or so. My Packet loss has dropped now but now i gotta deal with this issue and it has dropped me now 5-6 times the past hour for the past 2 hours sometimes for a min sometimes for 5 mins. I do not know whats going on but its pissin me off.
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Dashock @ 17th Nov 02:31PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

You gotta hear this SO the Tek rep made a call to bell about my sync problems so the bell guy calls and tries to trouble shoot with me and says if its not an outside issue which he does not think it is if they have to do a diagnostic they will be charging me. If they have to install any lines they will be charging me. I told them ive been having issues for the past 2 months and iwas told this would be fixed by the 22nd but it was the packet loss issue. No surprise he had no idea about a packet loss issue. And then i told him for awhole week and half i was runnin on 1.27 mbs when my connection was supposed to be 5 mb he said " We only offer 3 mb but we say up to 5 mb ? "

I was like you know what just put me with a conference call with a teksavvy rep at the same time so now i am waiting for a call back. I do not believe its a splitter issue i noticed other people having sync issues.
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Dashock @ 18th Nov 02:03PM:
Re: My Ordeal with Bell

Well i think as of last night the issues have finally stopped im finally back to my original speed with no packet loss or disconnection issues. Just took 2 months but hey lol.
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